[Clayart] Women and clay

Mon Apr 23 14:58:29 EDT 2018

Or a hut burned down and the clay lined basket was bisque fired.

RR

Quoting Terry Lazaroff <zalt57 at videotron.ca>:

> When I watch nature documentary I see animals get eaten, when they  
> stopped to drink.  I envision that early man noticed that indents in  
> the clay near the pond or lake,  held the water longer than in sandy  
> areas.  I envision someone taking a basket  and lining it with clay.  
> This allowed them to carry water and hold it for a while.  The  
> firing was probably discovered in the morning, perhaps because a  
> water vessel was set near the fire,  and it became hard on the side  
> of the heat generated by the fire.
>
> Things were discovered by accident.
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Apr 22, 2018, at 7:51 AM, Vince Pitelka <vpitelka at dtccom.net> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Terry -
>> This is getting a bit off-topic, but I don't think it was  
>> dangerous.  Does your dog get sick drinking from the pond or the  
>> gutter?  It all depends on the biological defenses that have  
>> evolved in the species or are built up from birth.  Tribal peoples  
>> can store and consume foods in porous bonfired pottery, but if we  
>> did the same we would get sick. As to what the first pots were used  
>> for when people started making pots early in the Neolithic period,  
>> they were used for everything that needed storage in a container,  
>> and likely for all sorts of ceremonial and religious purposes as  
>> well.
>> - Vince
>>
>> Vince Pitelka
>> Appalachian Center for Craft
>> Tennessee Tech University
>> vpitelka at dtccom.net
>> sites.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Clayart [mailto:clayart-bounces at lists.clayartworld.com] On  
>> Behalf Of Terry Lazaroff
>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2018 10:38 PM
>> To: Clayart international pottery discussion forum  
>> <clayart at lists.clayartworld.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Clayart] Women and clay
>>
>> I often wonder what the first pots were used for.   I believe they  
>> were developed to carry water from the source to the tribe or cave.  
>>  Drinking at the pond was very dangerous.
>>
>> Terry
>>
>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>>
>> From: Vince Pitelka
>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2018 11:24 PM
>> To: 'Clayart international pottery discussion forum'
>> Subject: Re: [Clayart] Women and clay
>>
>> Hi Robert -
>> As I said in a previous message, the hunter-gatherers of the  
>> Paleolithic discovered the phenomenon of fired clay and made small  
>> figurines and amulets, but clay pots don't travel well, so it was  
>> not until the Neolithic and the settled life of farmers and  
>> herdsmen that people started making pots as regular household  
>> accessories.  Your use of "Neolithic" is a bit confusing, because  
>> of course the Neolithic is the New Stone Age when humans began  
>> settling in villages as farmers and herdsmen.  It was during the  
>> Paleolithic that humans were hunter-gatherers.  I know that there  
>> is some spillover and that the distinctions are different in every  
>> part of the world.
>> - Vince
>>
>> Vince Pitelka
>> Appalachian Center for Craft
>> Tennessee Tech University
>> vpitelka at dtccom.net
>> sites.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Clayart [mailto:clayart-bounces at lists.clayartworld.com] On  
>> Behalf Of Robert Harris
>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2018 7:22 PM
>> To: Clayart international pottery discussion forum  
>> <clayart at lists.clayartworld.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Clayart] Women and clay
>>
>> ?The earliest ceramic piece found is the Venus of Dolní V?stonice -  
>> not pots. It dates to 25,000-29,000 BC. Significantly earlier than  
>> the first potential ceramic pots from China that are tentatively  
>> dated to 18,000BCE (there is some problem with the dating in this  
>> particular case, and the next earliest pots are Jomon at 10,000BCE.
>>
>> Although it is thought to be something of a religious object,  
>> there's actually no evidence that this is the case. Certainly there  
>> is nothing about it that implies it was made by a woman or a man.
>>
>> We know so little about neolithic hunter gatherers, and we have to  
>> remember that domestication of plants around 10,000 BCE totally  
>> changed everything about how humans lived their lives. The tribal  
>> societies for which we have good evidence - even the nomadic  
>> hunter-gatherers are likely to have lived significantly different  
>> lives from the Neolithic humans that had no concept of domestic  
>> plants or animals (except possibly half-tame wolves).
>>
>>> On Sat, Apr 21, 2018 at 10:39 AM, Jim Brown <jbrown1000 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> " With the transition to the Neolithic, people started making pots for
>>> practical use, but there is no evidence that it was women." - Vince
>>>
>>> Well, my first question would be, "Who were the ones using the pots?"
>>> Second, "Who were the ones tending the fires?"  Third, "Who were the
>>> ones doing the cooking?"
>>>
>>> Agreed that both men and women did take part in all the above but
>>> think most would agree that most of the answers to the above would  
>>> be women.
>>> Since it was women that were in close contact with the above, it would
>>> seem that women would be more likely to have made a pot out of clay
>>> while the men were more likely to have been making spear points.  As
>>> for little animals, etc., my guess goes to the children.  :)
>>>
>>>
>>> *                       JIM BROWN*
>>>
>>> *                 BROWN POTTERS*
>>>
>>> *  "Making handmade pottery . . . *
>>>
>>> *                                                . . . since the 1700's"  *
>>>                   *   386 479-4515*
>>> *            www.brownpotters.com <http://www.brownpotters.com>*
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Ron Roy
ronroy at ca.inter.net
Web page ronroy.net